Eighteen years ago, in August 1996, in the small Ural town of Kyshtym, events took place that became known throughout the world as the "Kyshtym phenomenon". The mummified body of the deceased creature was found in the apartment of an elderly resident of the village of Kaolinovy Tamara Prosvirina Sr., who at that time was placed in a psychoneurological clinic.
The pensioner's daughter-in-law, Tamara Prosvirina Jr., testifies that she saw this creature alive and the old woman allegedly even tried to feed him with chewed bread and gave him sweetish water. She called him Alyoshenka. The dwarf was only 25 centimeters high.
The mysterious mummy was in the possession of police officer Vladimir Bendlin, who was investigating this case, but some "ufologists from Kamensk-Uralsky" persuaded to give it to them, and then the body of the dwarf disappeared without a trace. "Ufologists" claim that Alyoshenka was taken from them by aliens.
All that was left were the witnesses who saw this mysterious little mummy, the operative video recording of its examination and a piece of matter with biological stains on which the little body lay …
This story still causes controversy among researchers. There is no definite answer to the question of what kind of creature it was. Periodically, interest in the Ural dwarf arises from various foreign television companies (in April this year, the Discovery film crew came to Kyshtym), the Kosmopoisk association continues its investigation. Ten years ago, the dwarf's genetic material was found and partially investigated.
About this - in an interview with the coordinator of the association "Cosmopoisk" Vadim CHERNOBROV
Vadim Alexandrovich, let's go back to 1996. When did you hear about this story yourself? What steps were taken immediately?
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- I found out about it quickly enough, like most people - from the newspaper. At first this story seemed to me such a terry "duck", too far-fetched, too unrealistic, because everything was too grotesque there. But after some time I found myself in the Chelyabinsk region (on expeditions I travel all over the country, and one of them took place in the South Urals) and decided to stop by Kyshtym, since I was in those parts anyway. That is, I would not have gone on purpose, to be honest … But when I arrived and began to clarify the circumstances of this story, everything turned out to be even more grotesque, even more illogical than it was described in the journalistic material.
How was it expressed?
- The journalist has no time to find out some things and therefore has to think out … This is a common thing. And with the "Kyshtym phenomenon" the reality turned out to be much more interesting than I heard. And since then I, if not every year, then quite often came and conducted research … And sometimes trips were made even twice a year. The last time I was there four months ago, I clarified some details … In other words, I believe that this story is not finished, and in the light of new details that come up periodically, it still requires clarification and research in many ways.
Vadim Chernobrov with matter where the Kyshtym dwarf was
What versions of the origin of the "humanoid" were put forward in "Cosmopoisk"?
- We must consider or at least keep in mind all possible, even incredible versions. I heard them about 15. Among those who were heard, who kept themselves as workers for research, of course, there were suggestions that this dwarf is a miscarriage or a mutant … The version that this creature belongs to the class of homo sapiens, in fact, was the most common among skeptics. Their opponents, of course, had other assumptions - that this is some kind of alien creature …
I tried not to use the word "alien" ever, if only because it is not entirely correct … As a synonym in this case, you can use the word "alien" … But at the same time, I do not consider any of the versions reliably proven. At the moment, the situation is such that there is too little data for a final conclusion, both for skeptics and for supporters that this is an alien or someone else incomprehensible.
What is your own interpretation of the origin of this creature?
- I just answered you: there are still no facts that unambiguously tip the scales in one direction or another. Moreover, I emphasize, this is what the person who has been developing this story all this time tells you. It seems that I should know more than anyone else, but nevertheless, I still have many questions to which I have not received answers. The topic of what happened to the dwarf before August 1996 and what happened to the dwarfs after … I have not made a reservation - it is with dwarfs, in the plural, has not yet been closed. How did we find out that there were several of them.
How?
- Yes. In different stories of eyewitnesses, and quite objective and reliable, appear from two to five such mysterious individuals at the same time, and there are stories where the dwarf is one. In particular, one local boss, who is not mentioned anywhere (many of our informers ask not to mention their names, so as not to subject them to ridicule, endanger their career and authority), saw this or another dwarf a few days before the events with Prosvirina Sr. … The dwarf looked quite healthy, stood on his feet …
That is, if it was the same Alyoshenka, then the boss saw him even before the creature was wounded. By the way, several people were found who, not without pride, realizing that they would not be criminally liable for this, of course, stated that, they say, they had hurt this creature by throwing stones or sticks at it. Such stories were from adolescents who saw several creatures in local dachas and vegetable gardens and treated them like rodent pests, for example, squirrels …
It can be assumed that some time after these meetings Tamara Prosvirina Sr. picked up this creature wounded and began to care for him. If this thread of the narrative is at least partially correct (and there were several such stories, for two weeks different people observed them in different parts of Kyshtym), then the version that it was a human embryo is crumbling at the root. He could not run or jump in any way.
Others have confessed to killing the dwarf. I made a promise to the person who made this confession that I would not make the issue public or litigate. I understand that there is no such article for the murder or mutilation of a non-human. I asked the person who confessed to the murder to explain in detail how it happened. And he told how drunk he accidentally crushed this little man. That is, it was an unintentional murder.
How did the version come about that this creature was killed?
- I guessed about it from indirect data after I got a piece of matter. This is the matter on which Tamara Prosvirina Sr. left the dwarf, and he died. This artifact, I mean a rag, was presented to me, now I have it safe and sound, not counting the small fragments that had to be cut out for genetic analysis. According to tissue studies, it turns out that the creature's body lay on it for a long time.
Sweat discharge remained on the matter, the contour of the spot corresponds in outline to the size and shape of this creature, which I know from the posthumous video. And in the place where the head of this creature should be, blood and some kind of white discharge are visible, which I regard as parts of the brain. If we remember that on the video the skull of this creature, so unlike a human, consists of four plates, and two of them "moved" from their original places, and a gap formed between them …
After I saw the matter, I turned to the video again and looked at this gap with different eyes. It indicates that these plates are unlikely to disperse by themselves. Consequently, someone pinched them from above … And when I "pressed" on one suspect eyewitness, he admitted that, as always happens in Russia, the man was drunk and accidentally piled on and crushed … the alien.
Now tell us about the other dwarfs. Where did they go?
- As for other dwarfs, I heard about them during my many visits to Kyshtym. Naturally, we organized expeditions to find these dwarfs, we had camps in the forest for a long time, where they were seen. Local residents flocked to us there. Everyone knew that we were looking for little people, and they said that they saw them there, saw them here …
There was a lot of information. Gradually, the idea was formed that the halo of the location of the dwarfs with time shifted away from Kyshtym. I can trace right through the years where and when they were seen, and it turns out that every year this "spot", or the area moved in one direction - along the Ural ridge …
In the end, for many years we have been coming with various expeditions to the Urals, I always keep this Kyshtym story in my head, and we interview new eyewitnesses. Moreover, each of them did not know the stories of the previous one, I did not publish them anywhere … But, unfortunately, for many years no new information has been received, and I have a feeling that this story with the "population" of dwarfs is perhaps over. At least, in Kyshtym itself, there is nothing of the kind.
On the Internet, versions about the extraterrestrial origin of the Kyshtym dwarf do not stop circulating. Probably, your investigation also did not ignore this topic …
- This version is based mainly on early newspaper publications that are now reprinted or retold in other media. It's a thankless job to evaluate such a thing. I want to say about one thing: it is believed that the body was later kidnapped … by UFO pilots. There was such a reliable story in quotation marks about how on the 78th kilometer of the Kyshtym - Kamensk-Uralsky highway a "plate" fell from above, allegedly the same dwarfs as the deceased came out of it, and demanded to give them the body of their compatriot (smiles).
And they gave it to them on pain of death … There was even such a scam - I won't say in which newspaper (guess yourself!): They collected money to erect a monument to the deceased alien on the 78th kilometer of this road. So, I was not lazy and checked the UFO abduction version. None of the excuses is confirmed, in particular, there is simply no road sign "78th kilometer" on the specified route. And it is not clear where a monument to this nonsense would be erected?
There are persistent rumors that now this mummy is kept somewhere in a private collection … What do you know about this?
- Naturally, nobody stole the body of the dwarf. “Ufologists” took away the mummy in a direction known to me, so at first it was kept in not very good conditions. The body smelled unpleasant, it was stored in the garage and from time to time shown to especially revered guests. It is known that once during such celebrations, the mummy's arm was broken off. This, of course, is not done with relics and artifacts …
And after the Japanese wanted to buy the Kyshtym dwarf, naturally, they began to store it better. Where he is now, I cannot say. The relevance of the discovery of this body has fallen: in the genetic plan, the value of matter is no less, and after we found it, the search for the mummy itself practically stopped.
What are the results of the analyzes that were done with the tissue?
- The genetic material on this piece of matter was discovered exactly 10 years ago, in 2004. Foreigners often ask the question: "How many public and private laboratories have expressed a desire to research this material?" I shock foreigners with the answer: "None." All analyzes were done on my initiative. Five studies were conducted. Of these, two are not brought to mind: there was not enough diligence and patience, and three showed that, firstly, of course, human female genes were found, and, secondly, gene samples were not identified, that is, these samples are not in the data bank where the genes of all living things on Earth are stored.
And what was the reaction to these studies?
- The reaction was quite peculiar. Some publications, having heard the first part of the results that human genes had been found, decided that this was enough. And there were headlines that the Kyshtym dwarf was identified, and he was not Alyoshenka, but Mashenka. In fact, this is only partially true. There is indeed a woman's genetic material on the shroud, this tissue was touched by Tamara Prosvirina Sr. There is no sensation in this … But the material of the second group of genes still remains unidentified. I do not hold a monopoly on it and am ready to submit it for examination as soon as those who wish appear, my only condition is not to export the material abroad.
Did you find Tamara Prosvirina Sr. alive?
- Yes, I did, but, unfortunately, she soon died under rather strange circumstances.
But you still managed to talk to her?
- You know, she was "treated" well enough by our psychiatry. So it was very difficult to communicate with her. I did not know this woman before the "treatment", so I cannot say how adequate or inadequate she was before. But unfortunately, it hurts to talk about how inadequate it was afterwards.
I am convinced that before this story its inadequacy did not go too far out of the norm … Now, in hindsight, the legend of her madness is running, and it is impossible to refute it. The image of Prosvirina Sr. remained in only one video, where she, shaved bald, in an insane asylum … At the same time, her reaction to these events with the "baby", to the way she looked after him, does not fit with the idea of madness … In my opinion, she had a completely adequate and humane approach to the situation.
Vadim Alexandrovich, what is the mystery of this woman's death?
- To be honest, I did not investigate the circumstances of this incident. It is clear that Prosvirina senior was interfering with someone. It's hard to say to whom now. And the mystery of death is at least in the fact that the woman, who practically did not leave the house by that time, found herself on the road far from home for her physical capabilities. At the same time, she was barefoot, that is, she went out, relatively speaking, for a second and went far …
On the road she was hit by two cars, and you must see that road! If one and a half cars a day pass through it, that's already a lot, and here there are two cars. Well, the most amazing thing in this story is that to my simple question from the police, "What did the investigation, inquiry, investigation show?" they answered me sincerely: “But there was no consequence. We didn’t open cases because the woman was crazy …”Of course, I am not a great expert in jurisprudence, but, in my opinion, it is not within the competence of a police officer to decide whether to initiate a criminal case or not. The reluctance to deal with this case and find out the circumstances of the death of the elderly woman, to reveal whether she herself is to blame for this or not, causes most of all bewilderment in this case.
I did not make an official request, I did not conduct my own investigation … Now I voice the opinion of people who knew the deceased, her neighbors, who were unwitting witnesses … Well, again, I will not say that this incident happened just a couple of days before the arrival of a film group from Japan to Kyshtym. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but these incomprehensible combinations and coincidences raise a number of questions to which I have no answers. I understand that Prosvirina Sr. is not the biggest and most important witness, she was a very weak informant, but nevertheless there is much that is still incomprehensible in her disappearance.
Did you have a conversation with Ms. Semenkova from Kamensk-Uralsky, the one who introduced herself as a ufologist and took away Alyoshenka's mummy?
- I came to this woman's home, found her apartment, came to her several times, they either did not open the door for me, or they said: "She will come later." But Semenkova did not want to communicate with me. Instead, I saw myself being followed naturally. A young man followed me with his tail while I examined the sights of this wonderful Ural city. I then pretended that I did not notice this tail … What kind of "tail" - a friend or someone else, I will leave without comment.
You talked about meetings in the Urals with such small creatures, and in others there were similar finds of "humanoids"?
- Three or four stories are described on the Internet and in the media that are close to our Kyshtym case, but I try not to appeal to facts or incidents, the reliability of which I have not personally verified.
Vadim Alexandrovich, I would like to hear your advice - how did the heroes of this story in Kyshtym have to act so that there were no unsolved mysteries? How should people act when they witness anomalous phenomena?
- I don’t want to say that I would do this and that in the place of these or those people. As much as a person is theoretically prepared, such meetings happen so suddenly that people forget about all the advice. The most common and simple recommendation when encountering anomalous phenomena is, firstly, not to be afraid … I do not know of a single reliable episode when people encounter any intentional aggression and hostility from such phenomena.
I am deeply convinced and ready to prove this that if there are extraterrestrial civilizations and they are able to reach us, then there can be no question of any aggressive intentions in them. That is, by the time they grow to intergalactic or interstellar flights, civilizations will have long experienced such "childhood diseases" as belligerence and aggressiveness that we, savages, suffer …
Militancy is based on a lack of intelligence, on an economic motive, on the desire to seize something from someone, to take something away. If civilization has learned to fly, it means that the issue with energy, with access to minerals has been resolved long ago. It is foolish to think that someone will fly in to devour us, or to take away oil, or beads and mirrors … Therefore, first of all, one should not be afraid. Secondly, and this does not contradict the first point, if you are not sure of your knowledge, you cannot approach such subjects. After all, no one is surprised that you cannot approach vehicles on the road or an aircraft on a concrete strip …
There is no need to violate safety regulations. Stand quietly to the side and observe. You shouldn't run headlong towards this phenomenon or run away from it … The third very important point is that any information can age and lose scientific value, so the sooner you notify knowledgeable people about what you saw, the more important this event you saw will be for science. And, perhaps, this event will entail an investigation with far-reaching consequences …
A resource has now appeared on the Internet that allows you to track the appearance and movement of unidentified objects in real time and quickly respond to any event. 200 groups of "Cosmopoisk" in Russia and several dozen more in the world are ready to respond to your message at any time and, if necessary, go to the scene and conduct an investigation.
At the same time, I urge you to be careful about contacting the authorities, the police or doctors in such cases, as Prosvirina Sr. did her time. We know how her trips to the official authorities ended …
Are you in touch with Tamara Prosvirina Jr. now?
- We are in a wonderful relationship. Humanly, I respect her. Each time at the next meeting, Prosvirina Jr. bitterly regrets that she did not do this and that to prevent the death of little man Alyoshenka and ease the fate of her mother-in-law … Vladimir Bendlin repeatedly regrets that he believed these people from Kamensk-Uralsky and gave im a mummy.
But again, here we can only sympathize with him, I do not consider myself in the right to scold someone or say how smart and good I would have done in his place … Four months ago I saw all the main participants in this story, and not all they at that moment adequately assessed the events.
What is the reason for the current interest of the Discovery campaign in this story?
- Specifically, I don't know about Discovery, because I talked with journalists, and not with the producers who decide the relevance of a particular topic and, accordingly, give the go-ahead for the production of a new film. By indirect evidence, I understand that there, in the West, this event, this “Kyshtym phenomenon” is being studied quite closely. First, it is compared with messages from other countries. Secondly, this incident is really out of the ordinary …
I support any interest in this event, because, perhaps, thanks to public opinion, I will get access to new eyewitnesses who do not even know that the Kyshtym topic is still not disclosed and is under development …
And now, finally, I will tell you one secret. In April, during a trip to Kyshtym with Discovery, I separated from them and began to independently explore the place where we are planning to conduct large-scale research in the near future. Remember, I said that the story with the Kyshtym dwarfs is not over yet?