Live radio KP presenter Nikita Nepryakhin discusses with theologian Alexander Dvorkin and participant of the "Battle of Psychics" Victoria Zheleznova, who Wanga was: a psychic, a fraudster or a project of the special services.
Nepryakhin:
- The program "Two Truths" is on air. January 31 would have turned 102 years old one of the most mysterious characters of the twentieth century - the great Vanga. Until now, experts do not stop arguing whether we really dealt with a real miracle? Or is this the greatest mystification of the work of the special services?
Today our guest is Alexander Leonidovich Dvorkin, theologian, professor, head of the department of sectology of the Orthodox St. Tikhon's Humanitarian University.
Dvorkin:
- Good day!
Nepryakhin:
- And psychic, participant of the famous TV program "Battle of psychics" Victoria Zheleznova.
Promotional video:
Zheleznova:
- Hello!
Nepryakhin:
- Wang. What it is?
Zheleznova:
- I, of course, believe that Wanga was gifted with talents that can only be seen in a few people. She had a psychic gift, a gift of foresight. Vanga treated with herbs. And, undoubtedly, this is a great miracle. And we will honor her memory.
Dvorkin:
- I will speak at the same time regarding Vanga and the lady who is in the studio. I don't believe in extrasensory perception. I believe that psychics are, at best, scammers. Largely. And in the minority - these are people who are possessed by dark forces. In the case of Wang, I think there is a combination of two into one story, which shows that, undoubtedly, she had a connection with dark forces.
Nepryakhin:
- So, the dark story about Wang.
Dvorkin:
- The fact is that a good friend of mine is a metropolitan in Bulgaria, and Vanga lived on the territory of the diocese, where this metropolitan. And she constantly gave him a headache, since this all clearly contradicts the church. And what the church teaches. But once Vanga sent her people to the metropolitan, where she said that she was asking him to come. And the metropolitan is indeed a man of a holy life. He gives himself completely to the service of God and people. Extremely humble. He is a strict monk who used to live on Athos. And when he heard that this very elderly woman was calling him, he decided, maybe she wants to repent. And, like a good shepherd, he went there. The only thing he took with him was a reliquary cross, in which there was a particle of the Lord's Cross. The same one on which Jesus was crucified. He has arrived. Vanga has an entrance yard there: all the time people come in, come in. He went to her room. And I remind you that she was blind. And at the same time, people constantly entered and entered. However, she heard someone come in and suddenly changed dramatically. Her face and tone of voice changed. He held this reliquary cross in his hands. And she began to speak in a completely different voice, low, just growling: “Now a man has entered there. Let him immediately drop the thing that he is holding in his hands. I can’t with this thing … I don’t see anything!”. The Metropolitan told me himself. And everyone just didn't understand what it was about …Let him immediately drop the thing that he is holding in his hands. I can’t with this thing … I don’t see anything!”. The Metropolitan told me himself. And everyone just didn't understand what it was about …Let him immediately drop the thing that he is holding in his hands. I can’t with this thing … I don’t see anything!”. The Metropolitan told me himself. And everyone just didn't understand what it was about …
Nepryakhin:
- It's like some kind of devilry.
Dvorkin:
“It's just obvious. He held in his hands the greatest shrine, and demons feel the shrine. She felt and said that this shrine was blocking her path. She doesn't see anything.
Nepryakhin:
- Now bring me a shrine, I will not see it and I will not understand. But if she feels it, it means some mystical …
Dvorkin:
“So she was possessed by demons.
Zheleznova:
- Why demons?
Dvorkin:
- Because it is the devil, dear Victoria, who does not tolerate the shrine. If you hold out a glass of consecrated water to an obsessed person, then he simply begins to shake. This is a common test for identifying mentally ill people. There are many mentally ill people who describe themselves as possessed. But they are just mentally ill.
Give me two glasses. And if a person is possessed by demons, he will always feel in what holy water.
Nepryakhin:
- Recently in St. Petersburg, the city water utility in general consecrated everything. Then it turns out that …
Dvorkin:
“This blessed water flows quickly. And the one that is consecrated for Baptism, she protects believers throughout the year. It is indeed a shrine.
And I believe in Vladyka. He always speaks the truth. And he told this story. If she, without seeing, felt the shrine and reacted to it with indignation, obviously she was possessed by evil spirits.
Zheleznova:
- Do you believe that a person can be possessed by dark forces, but not by light ones?
Dvorkin:
- By definition, the forces of light cannot possess anyone.
Zheleznova:
- He can broadcast, deliver information …
Dvorkin:
- What kind of information? What nonsense are you talking about? A person cannot control spiritual forces. A person can pray to God, but always in the prayers of a Christian there is "let not my will be done, but yours." And ultimately, God decides. If a person says that he can force God to do something, if he does some kind of manipulation in order to force certain "light" forces …
Zheleznova:
“You’re probably talking about sorcerers.
Dvorkin:
- About psychics.
Zheleznova:
- Psychics do not practice witchcraft.
Dvorkin:
- For the Orthodox, there is no difference. But I think that you cannot distinguish holy water. I think I'm sorry … I think you are an ordinary quack.
Zheleznova:
- Thank.
Nepryakhin:
- We will not get personal now …
Dvorkin:
- I'm not a person. I'm talking about the profession.
Nepryakhin:
- You're a theologian. You must be good!
Dvorkin:
“And I have to warn people about the danger.
Nepryakhin:
- Alexander Leonidovich, do you believe in abilities? Now I don't care where it comes from. Dark or light forces …
Dvorkin:
- Not. I do not believe. But I believe that if a person is possessed by dark forces, I emphasize, in rare cases, this does not give superpowers. This means that the demon can in some cases suggest something in order to ultimately do a lot of harm. He will prompt twice correctly so that the person believes. And in the third so that you will never get out of hand.
Much honor for Vanga. What is Wanga? Now the excitement around her name is somewhat artificially maintained.
Nepryakhin:
- There was a serious conflict with the Bulgarian church over the construction of its temple.
Dvorkin:
“She built an ugly structure with nightmarish pictures that she called icons. They just make it bad. Saints are supposedly depicted there. But they are artistically helpless. Very bad. And these are completely non-canonical images. And the church declared that this temple has nothing to do with the church. If people go there, let them know that this is not a church temple. This is a temple named after this very old woman.
Zheleznova:
- She had the ability. And there is plenty of evidence for this.
Dvorkin:
- She had the psychological ability to breed people, to use the slang word. And she certainly had demonic possession.
Nepryakhin:
- And I don't really understand … There were always grandmothers in the villages …
Zheleznova:
- Grandma. Yes.
Nepryakhin:
- They helped, treated. I remember being taken as a child …
Dvorkin:
- Grandmother to grandmother strife. If there is a herbalist grandmother who understands herbs and treats a person, this is normal and natural.
If it's just herbs, no problem. If she's a chiropractor, too. But if some influences begin in addition to this, if she refers to spiritual influences, then she is definitely a witch. For the church, this is on the other side of good and evil.
Now, if a person turns to Victoria, our interlocutor, then according to the canons of the church he will be excommunicated from her for six years.
Zheleznova:
- Severely.
Dvorkin:
- As well as for murder.
Nepryakhin:
- How?! Horror!
Dvorkin:
- I had to voice it so that people would know.
Zheleznova:
- Vanga, indeed, was sent to people by God. And all her abilities are from the forces of light.
Dvorkin:
- Absolutely not!
Nepryakhin:
- We have the results of the telephone vote. 93 percent believe in the miracle of Vanga, 7 percent do not.
Thanks for the interesting conversation!
